455 Eley Colt New Service?

Bret4207

At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
Anyone have any info/experience on Colt New Service revolvers in 455 Eley that may or may not have been converted to 45 Colt? I found some info that seems to be a lot of opinion, but I don't know how accurate any of it is. It sure looks to me like the chambers are cut for a long 45 Colt and not a short little 455 Eley/British.
 

462

California's Central Coast Amid The Insanity
Anyone have any info/experience on Colt New Service revolvers in 455 Eley that may or may not have been converted to 45 Colt? I found some info that seems to be a lot of opinion, but I don't know how accurate any of it is. It sure looks to me like the chambers are cut for a long 45 Colt and not a short little 455 Eley/British.
I know for a fact that it was done to S&W 1917s that were British and Canadian marked, because I had one that was Canadian marked. It's bore was .457" and a .44 Mag. case would chamber (didn't have a .45 Colt case).
 

RicinYakima

High Steppes of Eastern Washington
Anyone have any info/experience on Colt New Service revolvers in 455 Eley that may or may not have been converted to 45 Colt? I found some info that seems to be a lot of opinion, but I don't know how accurate any of it is. It sure looks to me like the chambers are cut for a long 45 Colt and not a short little 455 Eley/British.
Yes. The NS 455's were chambered for the black powder long case, the Mark 1. That way any of the later, short case smokeless, ammo would fit. Also they have a very long tapered throat. But with that said, most have been reamed out for the 45 Colt. FWIW
 

Outpost75

Active Member
The .455 Eley cases were 0.87" long, the same as the pre-1900 .455 Mk1 black powder rounds. The New Service revolvers were chambered for the longer Eley or Mk1 cartridges so that they could also use the older service rounds and commercial ammunition which used the longer case. The .455 Mk2 case is 0.77" long and works fine in the longer Eley or Mk1 chamber, when soft bullets of adequate .454-.456" diameter are used.

Many New Service .455 revolvers were rechambered to accept .45 Colt ammunition, which works OK, but reduces collector value. As for the Webley top-breaks many had the rear of the cylinder faced off to provide moon clip clearance for .45 ACP ammunition.

While the .45 ACP conversion works just fine in the Colt New Service, which is a robust, solid frame gun, in top-break Webleys in which the cylinders have often been "shaved" to accept .45 ACP ammunition with moon clips, it is dangerous to fire full-charge .45 ACP GI ammunition. This is because M1911 Ball exceeds the proof pressure for the .455.

Older Webley "marks" prior to the Mk4 Boer War model do not have heat treated cylinders and were not even deemed safe with .455 Cordite ammunition unless cylinders were replaced with heat treated ones and the guns re-proved during Factory Through Repair, for WW1 service.

Much reload data for the .455 is based on the longer CIL-Eley-Canuck 0.87" length cases and is dangerous to assemble and use in the shorter, more common 0.77" Mk2 cases as produced by Fiocchi, Hornady or Starline.

Safe charges in Mk2 cases with 255-265 grain soft lead bullets of .454-.456 diameter are 3.5 grains of Bullseye or TiteGroup or 4 grains of HP38, 231, or WST, or 4.5 grains of Unique at minimum cartridge OAL 1.18" with common .45 Colt factory .454" diameter 255-grain lead conicals or similar common cast bullets such as Lyman #454190. My design for the .455 is the Accurate 45-264D.
 
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Bret4207

At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
I've read that a 45 Colt case will not enter a 455 chamber? Seems logical. I suppose I'll have to make a chamber cast if the gun stays around.

Thanks guys.
 

CZ93X62

Official forum enigma
I had an oppurtunity to buy one of these big beauties around the time I was retiring. It had shorter chambers than a 45 Colt, and was marked '455 Eley'. The price was reasonable and I almost Pulled The Trigger, but with a surprise retirement--too much month left at the end of the money--and not enough hours in a day most days--I elected to pass.
 

Missionary

Well-Known Member
We have one that is a "frankencolt". Barrel is marked .455 Ely. The cylinder chambers 45 Colt. No British Proofs on the frame that I could find.
Shoots OK out to 25 yards. Easily thwaks groundhogs through the chest / shoulder area.
 
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CZ93X62

Official forum enigma
I would love to own and carry a Colt New Service or S&W Model 25-series revolver in 45 Colt. I am quite fond of the S&W M-625 x 4" I bought a couple years ago.
 

Missionary

Well-Known Member
Well not any worse than a SAA. Certainly not a target revolver. But for what they were made for, quick defensive fire, very adequit.
 

Bret4207

At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
I actually didn't think the NS was all that bad sight-wise. Take a peek down the barrel of my 6" Iver Johnson 32 or Smith Perfected Model. They make the NS look like target sights!

It is a big honkin' gun though. I can use it DA, but it's a stretch for my short fingers. They were the first revolvers the early NYST (NYS Troopers back then) carried. Cross draw with lanyard, and they also carried a lead shot loaded riding crop! Different times!
 
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BudHyett

Active Member
My father carried a .45 Colt New Service on Guadalcanal and Guam. He was wounded in the landing on Guam and able to get the revolver home.

I remember Dad killing two Doberman Pinschers who were chasing our sows and pigs. When we pulled up in the truck, the dogs ran out toward us. Dad killed the first one at ten yards and the second one at forty yards at a full speed run. I now have the revolver and it will go to my son and down the line as a family heirloom.

The New Service was bought from a retired Dakota town marshal who wanted it to go to a service man in the war. The marshall told of how he was walking down the main street one day when four bank robbers ran out in front of him. The gun battle ended with a score of marshall-4, bank robbers-0, the trial was not lengthy. The marshall carved an Easter bunny in the grip, something unique.

The knife blade and gutter sight works well for long range shooting. I've shot it at the Elmer Keith Memorial match with 6.5 grains of Unique and the RCBS 45-230-RN at 140 yards. I treat it the same as the SAA for strength. It is accurate to that range with this light load,

Elmer Keith Memorial Shoot.ColtNewServiceGrip.JPG
 
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oscarflytyer

Well-Known Member
Once you figure out the the knife blade and gutter sight, its not all that bad, in my experience. Only LR I've done with it to date was a Colt Army Special 38 SPC (100 years old!), 6" bbl, at a measured 165 yds. Bench rest/164 grn RN cast (~850ish fps?!?)/24" sq plate. I was ringing it once I figured out how proud to go front blade. And a guy trying to dial a fancy AR prone/scope couldn't get it on! One guy even said they couldn't believe a 38 SPC round would even go that far! Tickled me, and caused me to burn another 3-4 cylinders full cause I could!

PS: I LOVE LR plinking with a wheel gun! And cast. And heavy bullets! AND, the chin drops I get at 'ringing the bell!"
 

Bret4207

At the casting bench in the sky. RIP Bret.
I have a Colt Officers Model 38 Spec. with a 7 1/2" barrel and adjustable sights. I'd love to find the time to really wring that one out at extended ranges. It has a bead front sight, not great for targets though. I think the old standard RN/PB would be my bullet of first choice.