My experiments with PC pistol and rifle bullets

Tomme boy

Active Member
When I worked for a Bodyshop supply house we sold PPG and DuPont and RM paints. Greens and reds were the thinnest of the paints. Meaning it took a extra layer or two to cover. Reds are the most expensive to make. Yellows and white and black had the most pigment. The rest are fillers and binders. I set up and tought the new systems to the shops when we took over their supply. I was trained by Dupont and PPG. The color scale was a nightmare sometimes. You had to pass a test of 100 colors and put them in order from one shade to the next. I had a hard time with reds for some reason.

Interior paint for the plastics was the worst thing in the business to match. The plastics as they aged would turn different colors and would absorb some colors better than others. We sold SEM if I remember right.

Don't even get me started on the tri coats! What a pain! It would be neat if we could do that with the PC. Silver bullet with a base layer of gold metallic clear with a blue or red tinted clear over that. I think it might work????
 

Pistolero

Well-Known Member
As far as the brakes at LeMans, they do change the pads periodically and I imagine even the disks once
or more during the race. They also have SERIOUS brakes. Brembo makes a lot of them, like these.

9692
 

fiver

Well-Known Member
the way the scca and prototype cars work around having to change the brakes is by using materials that don't really function unless they are up to temperature.
cold brakes are as inefficient as cold tires on those cars.
off the top of my head they don't even begin working properly until up to somewhere around 1,000-F.
the F-1 cars just use massive amounts of carbon fiber and large surface areas in theirs, their brake shoes are just about as wide as the tires they run.
their electric drives also help slow the cars down, most people don't know a F-1 car only makes about 160 horsepower [with a turbo no less] but have electric booster motors they can turn up or down.
they use braking energy to return juice back to the battery's.
it's such an efficient system they rarely talk about even having them.
 

Pistolero

Well-Known Member
I got my black 60% gloss powder today. Will dig out the toaster oven and see what I can do. I have plenty
of raw castings laying around to try. I think I have some airsoft plastic pellets, so, if I can find them
I will try using them for coating. I have some 1/4" hardware cloth and will wire it down to the
toaster oven rack, at least, I think I will at this point. Not sure if I will get to it today. I'll see how
this powder works. Some say it may not work well because of the "60% gloss"....maybe I screwed
up ordering,:( but I have it now and will give it a try.

Fiver, you are right on all of that on brakes, but a lot too low on the HP of a F1 engine. Definitely the electric/hybrid
(which I consider to be very silly/PC/stupid for a top racing formula) system is a huge part of the braking and
a big contributor (100 hp is tossed around, maybe twice that) short term drive as long as the battery holds
out, only a few seconds or so.
 
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Ian

Well-Known Member
The anticipated challenge is getting the dry powder to stick to the bullets via S&B method. My experience with several semi-gloss powders is that the powder basically falls off the bullets with the slightest disturbance when removing them from the container and anything that touches them (bbs, other bullets, needlenose pliers, hemostats, fingers, etc) completely removes the powder where contact was made.

Don't be afraid to shake the devil out of them in the container, i.e. go hard enough for a couple of minutes that everything is slapping mildly between bottom and lid and use an orbital motion to keep the mixture tossed around, then go as hard as you can straight up and down about a dozen times with firm pressure on the container lid to keep it from flying off and end on a hard downstroke. Gently place the container on a bench and open the lid without disturbing the bullets further. Then, one at a time, pick them out where they lie. You will likely need to re-shake a few hard up/downs to re-coat the last 25% or so of the bullets and maybe again to do the last few.

The powder is abrasive and what you're looking to do is basically embed the powder into the bullet's surface. I like to shake with enough duration and vigor that the bullet surface looks like glass-bead-blasted aluminum if I wipe off the powder. I feel that peening off the surface oxide layer of the bullet and texturing it via shaking provides a much better bond than spraying does, and once you perfect your techniques and tools to suit your own preference the coating can be much more even all around the bullet than when using an ES spray gun.
 
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Pistolero

Well-Known Member
That is good info, Ian. I was wondering about the comments that some just swirl and 'generate
static', but I have no idea what is what at this point.

Bill
 

popper

Well-Known Member
Many years ago I remember reading a report on the Biomoto 1200cc honda powered racer. Driver goes into a sweeper (120 or so), grabs the handle and nothing happens. Pits and then they tell him to 'test' the brakes before he needs them. First time with carbon fiber. Tech and driving techniques have sure changed. I think it would be a bit scary to get a blue screen of death on the wheel going into a twisty @ 150. Kinda miss the tailpipe flames on downshift though.
Got the magnetospeed on jax in the 308, 2330 & ES=12. BO with cast wasn't worth the time. Need to get a GC mould for that with softer alloy.
 

fiver

Well-Known Member
shake them hard enough your cheeks jiggle.
do that 2-3 times for about 10 seconds a time.
the swirl thing is to distribute the powder throughout the BB's and bullets.
I do a swirl to the top and let everything fall to the bottom edge just to get the powder floating around.

my cups are clear and I can see inside to watch what is happening and how much powder I have left in the cup.
I try to adjust how much I use so I have none left over, which helps me judge how much more I need to shake.

also give the powder dust 10-15 seconds to settle down before you open the container, you don't need that stuff floating around any more than necessary.
 

Brad

Administrator
Staff member
Fiver, do you have you wife do the coating so you can watch her cheeks jiggle? :oops:

Bill, I swirl for maybe 5-7 seconds then vigorous back and forth for 30-40 seconds with an occasional up and down.

I don’t use any BB’s and that is likely why I get thinner coatings.
 

Pistolero

Well-Known Member
Sounds like fun.:D
Thanks for the suggestions, guys. I think I'll be using a frosting container. Sorta tall and thin-ish.
I esp appreciate the advice on waiting for the dust to settle down before you open it up. I hadn't thought of that.
 
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fiver

Well-Known Member
i think you just drop the whole capsule in and chase it down.

my wife can't even have fun at a 100$ comedy show in Las Vegas.
she chose the show, she made me take her,,,, not even a smile.
 

wquiles

Active Member
OK, got a problem with PC coating that I have not seen before - I wonder if I am over cooking them (too long)? It is probably my bad, as I didn't keep record of the last time. The oven is still set to 400 (and I pre-heat the oven), but I these I baked for 25min.

These are the 35 cal Lee 200 before baking:



and after - a lot less coverage than I expected:



I then did the 30 cal Lee 155 gr, and also came up with little coverage:



So I gave the 30 cal Lee (above) a second coat today - baked again for 25-30min. This is before:



But look how horrible/nasty they came out:



I also re-coated the 35 cal ones. This is before:



and again, after:




Except for now realizing that I should only bake for 15min - any other advice/comments?

Will
 

Gary

SE Kansas
I usually bake for 20 min on mine so the 25 min isn't the problem IMO. Whose pwd you using? I've had great success with Smokes pwd.
 

wquiles

Active Member
Smokes. In fact, this is the 3rd batch of bullets using that John Deer Green, so maybe the powder got humid or went bad?