Old ideal . 40143 .

RBHarter

West Central AR
I got this one in a box of "you want this , I got everything I wanted and I'm tired trying to sell these ." kind of deals .

I had an LBT copy long ago but it wouldn't do anything for me that the Lee 401-175 didn't except cast 1/3 as many per pour . In any case I had this rich fantasy where I would get by with 1-2 moulds per caliber/cartridge , and that oddball went down the road .

Being as the number is 43 i expect it was originally for a 38-40 .
IMG_20200207_162519322_HDR~2.jpg
Of course if anyone has any notions insights or information about it I'm all eyes .

This will go in a 40 at 900 fps or so if it is actually only 175 gr .
 

Ben

Moderator
Staff member
One of my favorites in the .40 S&W.

Mine drop from the mould at .403"
 
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F

freebullet

Guest
Lol. Ben has more calibers then the fbi lab, Brad. He just doesn't like to talk about the ones that get any ninja or tactical feedback.;)
 

CZ93X62

Official forum enigma
In the dim and distant past.......before there was an Internet.......perhaps before there was air--there was the 38/40 WCF.

Circa 1975 a lot of development was being done on cartridges and platforms to bridge the "gap" perceived between the 9mm and 45 ACP in the semi-auto pistol universe. The 10mm came first (commercially), and was little more at first than cut-off 30 Remington brass and 38/40 bullets blended into a very capable cartridge. Among those first bullets were both jacketed and cast 38/40 projectiles, which worked very well since the JSP designs were built to expand in the same 1200 FPS envelope that a Winchester '73 was meant to run in. Norma Projektilfabrik got into the act, and produced 200 grain bullets for the caliber and loaded them to run 1200 FPS in the Bren Ten--which absorbed these beast-loads with aplomb. Colt and clones of the 1911 persuasion......not so much. The 175 grain W-W Silvertips @ 1250 FPS are about as hot as a Colt should be run with, and I use that as my stop point with my Glocks too.

The 40 S&W was designed to fit the frame geometries of 9mm platforms. FBI found out early-on that a lot of their personnel had trouble managing the 10mm recoil and bark, and 10mm Lite (still loaded by Federal) resulted. The 40 S&W's ballistics and performance envelope is a close imitation of 10mm Lite, 180 grain JHPs in the 950-1000 FPS ZIP Code. The 40 S&W case is just a 30 Remington (again) punched with a small pistol primer pocket.

I like the 40 S&W. My subjective opinion is that the 40 is a mite harder to handle that the 45 ACP in terms of recoil and bark, but among the troops at my old shop it is the consensus favorite caliber. I like all four calibers, and load all four calibers. I don't carry the 9mm due to our ^&%$-poor authorized ammo that can't make decisive stops on JACKRABBITS in that caliber, but with better ammo I would move the 9mm into my carry rotation. My usual in-town armament is OC gel canister and Glock 23. Thankfully, no usage of either so far--but a close call a year ago and a few others from time to time. I like the 40 S&W as felon repellent, but the 45 ACP is no slouch. 10mm is my longtime favorite, though. Basically, the 40 S&W duplicates 38/40 performance from a revolver; 10mm duplicates 38/40 performance from a '73 Winchester. There truly is nothing new under the sun.
 

462

California's Central Coast Amid The Insanity
Allen,
I really enjoy your history lessons, as it seems I pick up some new tidbit of trivia.

I contemplated long and hard whether to go with .40 S&W or .45 ACP, for a carry gun. My initial inclination was the .45, because of the owning the Randall, but the .40's smaller frame won the day.
I haven't given up on the .45 as I do like its larger hole, and Glock's Blue Label program makes their sub-compact less expensive than even a Springfield.

Edit to erase the letter "l" that was hanging off the end of trivia.
 
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RBHarter

West Central AR
My current whatever load for an XD40 2.5" is the Lee but as mentioned I had an LBT version of this mould in a .403-175 also . Both need to be WDWW for the max load of Unique , where the groups were still closing . In that example they delivered 940-950 fps with true weights at 178 and 182 gr . I thought then to myself "that's pretty close to 45 ACP and I get 4 more chances . "
 

fiver

Well-Known Member
the old 38-40 molds work perfect in the 40 short.
probably better than they do in many of the old 38-40's they were designed for.
 

358156 hp

At large, whereabouts unknown.
I shot lightweights in my 40s, back before I got to be a 357 SIG "Cool Kid" :). I even had the first new S&W Sigma, in S&Ws newest "Hot" caliber the 40 S&W. Back then I was the coolest of all :cool:. Then the Sigma flopped but I had traded mine off towards a Beretta 96 Centurion just before the bubble burst on Sigma, making me probably the only winner in that debacle. The 96 worked perfectly and life was good, my favorite loads at the time were Nosler 135 gr JHP, loaded to an advertised 1300 fps. Smokin'! My cast loads were pedestrian velocity 180 gr from a SAECO 4 cavity mould. Then a ParaOrdnance P14 entered my life and that was the end of the 40s. Everything has been revolving around 1911s and 45 ACP until 357 SIG entered my life, To split the difference, I'm waiting for the crazy demand for SIGs new 1911s, chambered in 357 SIG to level off, then I'll have that too. I'll probably end up with another 40 S&W in something, but nothing has caught my eye yet. If I were limited to 10 round magazines, it would be tough to choose between a 40 S&W and 357 SIG. SIG would probably win because of all the components and moulds I have for it. But unlike the newest generation of cool kids, I have no problems with 40 S&W at all.
 

CZ93X62

Official forum enigma
Beretta 96 was my uniform duty sidearm for the last 5 years of my career. Nice pistol, those Italians design and build beautiful machines. From my case work, I could not see any significant difference between 40 S&W and 45 ACP results when our deputies used either to exchange finality with armed assailants. Both are decisive.

The 10mm Auto and the 41 Magnum are two of the most under-rated and over-achieving handgun calibers in existence.

A friend of mine has a very nice Colt New Service in 38/40. I have strived mightily to talk him out of it, but no soap. He doesn't shoot it, being of a thrifty mindset he doesn't want to pay for factory ammo to run in it. He also isn't interested in reloading for it (or his carry arms). Hard to figure some folks out. I have no experience with the caliber outside of strafing runs at the New Service which remain unproductive. Truth to tell, I need another caliber to keep track of like a trout needs a mountain bike.
 

fiver

Well-Known Member
I been eyeballing that new Sig in 357 too.
the msrp being in the 7-800$ range is slowing me down some but I'm thinking a 6 sumthin or less street price might be acceptable.
 

obssd1958

Well-Known Member
I actually used the 40143 in a 38-40 chambered rifle. For a couple of years, I owned a Colt Lightning, that was manufactured in 1891. As a pump action rifle, shooting 38-40 fodder, it was a blast to shoot!!
I found early on that the bore was very ummmmm..... generous...... and had to beagle my mould to .406-7 to be able to shoot much without filling it with a mountain of lead deposits.
I sold it to a guy that gave me more than double what I paid for it, but there are times when I long to have it back...