A minor rant

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Petrol & Powder

Well-Known Member
I try not to be overly critical of companies that sell firearm related products but every now and then, I think some of them need to check their egos.

Today I received a catalog from Dillon Precision. I like the company and I like their products. However, they have become very proud of the products they sell, and not just the proprietary Dillon products. Their own products have always been costly, but that attitude seems to have spread to the other products they sell retail for other manufacturers. I don’t mind paying for quality but there’s a limit to what is reasonable. Particularly when there are equal (and I mean totally 100% equal) options for less money.

I will not go into a line-by-line breakdown, but this recent catalog appeared to be lot of glitz and not a lot of substance. I started comparing non-proprietary products that could be sourced from other companies and found significantly lower prices on everything I compared. The moral of the story there – always shop around.

Then I looked at some proprietary Dillon products and attempted to gauge how much the price of those products has increased. Now, I fully understand inflation and the decreased buying power of the dollar, but damn! Take their primer flip tray for example; $33 in the catalog, $29 on-line …….for a piece of metal with some concentric grooves! Probably groves that are just molded into the tray. That’s not exactly a high-tech piece of gear. It is for certain not $33 worth of zinc, iron, or whatever it’s made of.

OK, I’m done ranting.

I hope Dillon doesn’t shoot themselves in the foot with this glitzy advertising and boutique (read that as exorbitant) pricing. I don’t think that’s their customer base.
 
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richhodg66

Well-Known Member
None of their products ever interested me anyway. I have ZERO interest in progressive loaders and that's all they do. My brother had one of theirs and eventually sold it. He did tell me that he had a kind of snotty customer service experience with Dillon,can't remember any real details.
 
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Petrol & Powder

Well-Known Member
I have experienced excellent customer service from Dillon. I also like their progressive presses. However, I fear they will alienate their customer base if they don't remain competitive.
 
hporter

hporter

Active Member
I am a self professed Dillon fan boy. But even I noticed the last catalog I received didn't have any interesting articles, and lots and lots of bling for the younger tacticool folks.

I don't mind paying a premium for their Dillon branded gear. They support their equipment better than any other company that I have ever dealt with. I sent in a Dillon 650 that I had bought used for their refurbishment service, and they sent me a brand new press for the $80 refurbishment fee. Every time I have called for a broken part, I have been advised it was on it's way without any discussion of expense. That is worth paying extra for in my opinion.

I also don't mind if their prices are higher than their competitors. It is our job to shop for the best value for our dollar. Not that it was implied in this thread, but they certainly are not the Walmart of the reloading equipment companies.

I almost bought a Labradar from them a few months back. They were having a free shipping sale, and their price was the same as Midway. But for some reason, when I went back to put it in my basket, I couldn't find the chronograph again. I am glad that happened, because now I can get the Garmin unit instead.

I do agree with P&P that not much in the catalog interests me, but then I am older and have most of the stuff I need already. I think of all that reloading bling like the Sears and JC Penny Christmas catalogs of my youth. It is something for those who wish to have, and want to dream about purchasing to admire. I wish they would put more space in it for the technical and historical articles they used to do. I value that much more.
 
fiver

fiver

Well-Known Member
i haven't had to order any parts or anything from them in 20 years.
i'd probably have an aneurism just seeing the price increase on the little plastic things that get used up over time.
 
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Petrol & Powder

Well-Known Member
hporter said:
I am a self professed Dillon fan boy. But even I noticed the last catalog I received didn't have any interesting articles, and lots and lots of bling for the younger tacticool folks.
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I'm not sure I would call myself a Dillon fan boy but I might fit that description. I've been very happy with their products. Their customer service is TOP notch. I agree the "tacticool" offerings are getting more than just a little thick in their lineup. I could also do without all their bling.
I suspect the audience they are catering to is the younger crowd but those are not likely to be the people that buy their traditional loading gear.

hporter said:
Every time I have called for a broken part, I have been advised it was on it's way without any discussion of expense. That is worth paying extra for in my opinion.
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The time I needed a part, they sent it for free even after I offered to pay for it. The other occasions I was purchasing items via the phone (pre-internet days for me) and they were fantasic to deal with. I don't mind paying for that level of service but I draw the line at prices beyond reason.
 
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Petrol & Powder

Well-Known Member
fiver said:
i haven't had to order any parts or anything from them in 20 years.
i'd probably have an aneurism just seeing the price increase on the little plastic things that get used up over time.
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I haven't HAD to buy anything from them but I hope they stay in business in case I WANT to buy something from them. :)
 
Brad

Brad

Benevolent Overlord and site owner
Staff member
I have a minor rant too- damned kids won’t stay off the lawn…

Dillon has done me right. I contacted them as a screw hole on the part the goes over the primer slide stripped. They replaced it at no charger and sent new primer slides as well.
 
S

Sloughfoot

Member
I’ve loaded some high quality ammo in a Lee press and Lee dies. My first Lee press bought as a kit in 2001 functioned without fail for 21 and a phone call fixed the issue for the price of shipping. I do have a rcbs rock chucker that I bought used at a steal and it most certainly is a well made beast. I have no need to ever browse Dillions ridiculousness. But hey if it suits you go for it.
 
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Jeff H

NW Ohio
Petrol & Powder said:
I haven't HAD to buy anything from them but I hope they stay in business in case I WANT to buy something from them. :)
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Now, THAT, I GET!

I have zero need for what Dillon sells, but respect them and their products, I feel the same way, as expressed in the quoted post, about several companies which make what we like - I want them to stay in business, but wonder how they can do it with the prices I'm seeing.

I think it comes down to the sad fact that, as we get older, our "say" in the market gets weaker.

"Damned kids these days" sort of thing. There just seems to be an awful lot of people willing to pay whatever for everything or anything any more. Having saved for something or having things you can say are "paid for" are not as important as having everything I want, NOW. It seems to be a bit of a status thing and there is little appreciation or regard for spending/over-sending.

I can't imagine an ad saying "now pipe down, kiddies, the geezers know better..." Hell, no! Us geezers are skin-flints, stick-in-the-muds and subject to a decades-long, drawn out period of self-immolation by means of self-deprivation of self-gratification and suffer from just way too much masochistic fiscal responsibility, when money isn't even really real and it's all someone else's anyway. We geezers might forego the gratification of color-matched bullet-boxes in deference to recycled containers. I know some of us who will suffer though a year's worth of peanut butter or mayonaise they don't even like because the jars hold exactly 200 429421s!

Who would YOU target if you were selling stuff?

Dang, I sound like a geezer.:oops:

Should I be capitalizing "Geezers?"
 
waco

waco

Springfield, Oregon
I agree their prices, just like everybody else, is going through the roof. That being said I have no plans on making any "big" Dillon purchases in the future. I have my 550 and my super swage. Like all the others have mentioned, customer service has always been next to none. The few times I have needed replacement parts the only question I get asked is where do you want us to ship it? Never any cost to me. Great people to deal with IMO.
 
CZ93X62

CZ93X62

Official forum enigma
IIRC, Mike Dillon (God rest him) developed his presses to service a niche market of machine gun enthusiasts that needed to feed their go-fast war toys. I was never really drawn into the Dillon mystique--I am sure they are fine machines, but I have no interest in fully-progressive reloading.

I did speed things up 22 years ago with a Ponsness-Warren P-200 turret machine that the company calls 'Semi-progressive'. If I get my components set properly, I can load 180-200 rounds per hour without much fuss & bother. I do not regard reloading as a chore to be discharged with all possible speed. For someone like me--deeply invested in RCBS tooling--the P-W system made sense, and can load all pistol rounds without issues. 22 Hornet and the 25/20, 32/20, and 44/40 are easily serviced on the P-200, and there is a larger machine that can handle large rifle calibers up to 375 H&H lengths. I load 223 on the P-W via sizing on the Rockchucker then moving the brass over to the P-W for priming, powdering, and bullet seating. I'm sure I could do similar things with 243, and possibly 6.5 x 55 and 30-06.......but I don't shoot enough of those to make the leap from single-stage processing.

Finally--most retailers are having their way with hobbyists currently, and for the past several years. Dillon isn't any different than the rest of them.
 
hporter

hporter

Active Member
Jeff H said:
There just seems to be an awful lot of people willing to pay whatever for everything or anything any more.
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This is certainly part of the equation. During the Wuhan Flu, I sold my second 550 on eBay. It was bid up beyond the cost of a new 750 with conversion kit. I was shocked, but that might have been more due to crazy high demand (fear) and the lack of supply. My father raised me with the idea that if you didn't have the cash in the bank to make a purchase, you couldn't afford it. Given the statistics on the financial news segments, people in general are high in credit card debt - especially the younger generations. There is not much to impede your sense of entitlement to "a want" paired with a lack of funds - if it is just an Apple Pay swipe away from being yours.

Jeff H said:
Us geezers are skin-flints
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This made me chuckle, because my wife is forever wringing her hands at how tight I am with money. I hope I don't get so bad that I start wearing my drawers inside out the next day to save on laundry soap.....

Jeff H said:
Who would YOU target if you were selling stuff?
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I hadn't really thought of that, but I think this is 100% why Dillon has shifted the types of items in their catalog. Older folks tend to have most of what they need, especially if they have been in this hobby most of their life. The younger generation may have empty shelves in their hobby room, and judging by most of the LGS's around here - that is why black rifles and black striker fired handguns fill their inventory about 95% (leaving out the motivator of fear of government overreach and the thought that you may not be able to purchase something in the future).

My other interest in life is photography. And it blows my mind how much money some people are paying for high end cameras as complete rank amateurs entering the market. They haven't mastered the basics of exposure and lighting, and they are blowing many thousands of dollars on cameras that won't make them any better of a photographer than a used $200 camera from the pawn shop.

There is a similarity between the two hobbies though - high capacity shooting! Take a thousand photographs and pick out the one or two good ones you managed to take. Or shooting a half dozen 30 round magazines at a target 50 yards away that looks like a shotgun blast when you are done, but there are a few in the 10 ring.. Ha ha ha.
 
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Petrol & Powder

Well-Known Member
It is entirely possible Dillon is targeting a younger audience and there may be wisdom to that strategy. However, Dillon sells more than just progressive presses and accessories for those presses. Dillon also distributes products from other companies and that is where I see a lot of the glitz. I don’t know if their real profit rests with the collateral products or if they are just capitalizing on their impulsive audience.

I’ve owned a 550 for many years and I’ve loaded on other Dillon presses, including a 1050. Although I prefer the 550, I find all the Dillon progressive presses to be well made. Their customer service is excellent. The company did have vision and does make quality products, it’s their marketing that seems to be going astray, IMO. You may be able to attract a younger crowd with the glitz and tacticool products but how many of them will stay in the hobby? How many of them will become reloaders? Which customers are you alienating in pursuit of the tacticool crowd? Maybe I am out of touch with the market and a true geezer?

Inflation, taxes, transportation, labor costs and lots of other expenses make it difficult for any company to turn a profit. I don’t expect prices to remain stagnant. Nor do I ever begrudge any business the effort to make as much profit as they can. But slick advertising costs a lot. Overpriced products steer me away (and probably other potential buyers). Ultimately – The Company does not set the selling price, they only set the ASKING price. The Buyer Sets the Price He is Willing to Pay.
 
T

Thumbcocker

Active Member
2 550B presses. First one acquired in 1986 still works just fine. The few small parts that have worn out were replaced free. The Scheel's in Springfield, Illinois cars a fair selection of Dillon stuff. I have not ordered from the catalog in many years. The trend in shooting is the AR platform and polymer framed striker fired. Not my thing but that is reality. If bolt action, blue steel, walnut, and single action were trending catalogs would cater to that.
 
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