NOE's 311291 In The 30-06....WOW !!

[quicksylver]

Hi guys....Dan here with the third installment on the NOE 311291 trials..

This time the platform was my 1919 1903 Rock Island Springfield with a Lyman 24x LWBR scope..and before you collectors start screaming (moaning anyways) ..I got this rifle as a botched up sporter..it had been T&D for a scope and shoved into an after market stock..beded with wood putty..needless to say the previous owner never got to shoot it...it does sport a pristine High Standard 4 grove barrel...I've sliped it into a nice period "C" stock ..inspected twice by Daniel A Leary...I've also added all the rest of the correct fun stuff..original hardware etc...

Here's a picture of it..

As I said this is the third and last installment on my retesting of the 311291 design..this bullet cast from a NOE (Night Owl Enterprise) mold has proven to be an outstanding performer..period..

Here are the groups I got out of it using the above mentioned platform...

Perhaps I should explain the "bad Bullet".. I had WRONGLY used a charged case to check the AOL ..the bullet pulled from the case leaving the gas check in the case when I tried to extract it,so I reseated the bullet slightly deeper than the others..obviously I created a load with it's own mind..and speaking of "mind"..notice how mine gets tried as I continue to shoot and the groups open up..

I also tried the NOE 311407 MOD ..need more testing there..

For my results using this bullet in the 30-30 and .308 Win. please follow these links...they are worth a glance for sure..
http://www.artfulbullet.com/index.p...1-in-the-308-winchester-showing-promise.2586/
http://www.artfulbullet.com/index.php?threads/ok-so-maybe-the-311291-aint-so-bad.2509/

Thanks for looking.... Dan

 

[Ian]

Am I seeing a trend here with BR/BLL opening up groups after 10-20 shots?

 

[quicksylver]

Ian ..one could come to that conclusion by looking at the groups I've posted..but before I did that I would have my buddy try shooting my bullets..
He doesn't cast but is an incredible shot, having competed in major competitions before loosing one eye to infection...he can still out shoot anyone I know..his two hundred yard groups still look like our best 100 yd ones..

I'll have him try 20 and see what happens...

As an aside..in the last couple of weeks or so he has convinced me to break out my Ar15 comp ( I haven't shot it in comp. for about 15 yrs) and put a scope on it...I did so ...going through 20 rnds of my favorite loads at 100 yds ..my groups opened up from a shy 3/4" to 1 1/4"..again my use of a scope and eye strain ...and BTW I did take the time to set it up for me and it was better..thanks for the input on using them...

I used to get 10 round 3/4"to 1" 100 yd groups prone with iron sights out of my AR before I gave up ( I was coming in third at our club matches)...scopes are just retaining my group sizes at this point...but I'm happy...

 

[Ian]

Dan, I still think you have a big problem with your diopter settings. I can stay in a good piece of glass for 6-8 hours and not get eye strain, and I get eye strain quite easily these days, so I think you have other issues. That would explain the trend of bugholes to patterns that we've seen with a lot of your cast loads lately.....except the Garand? You did some impressive shooting with that one when the light was right, and seemed to be able to keep it up for quite a few groups (that's no small feat at the loading bench when using cast bullets in an auto-loader), so your diagnosis of scope eye strain makes perfect sense. If you haven't, take the time to correct the diopters of your scopes and see if that doesn't help.

Another thing, the El Paso Weaver scopes were good in their day, but by modern standards of even the cheapest scopes have pretty lousy glass and no coatings to speak of, but still they shouldn't cause focal strain if you don't stay in them for extended periods.....assuming of course the diopter is correctly adjusted for your shooting eye.

Here's a link to one article briefly describing diopter and how to set it, there are many other resources and videos on the web too. http://www.accuracy-tech.com/ocular-lens-focus-and-parallax-adjustment/

 

[quicksylver]

Ian...I just checked out the article..very interesting and timely as my new scope for the AR showed up in todays mail...

First thing I did was read the instructions that came with it..no real help there..however I did follow the instruction in the article for setting up the diopter...BOY is that clear and sharp !!!
I then installed it in the rings and adjusted the eye relief so as to get a full field of view when I shouldered it...then I set it on 100 yds and sighted across one of the ponds to about where I thought 100 yds was...I kept doing this and moving the scope in and out untill it was as natural as I could get it..I'm thinking that's what is wrong with my other scopes.... I set the scopes in the rings where I thought they should be for an offhand hold and now am trying to use them for bench rest by screwing the diopter out until I get a full view sight picture..wrong.. diopters aren't meant to set eye relief..right?

What I need to do with the new one is leave the screws slightly loose as I have done and the diopter set where it is, then take the gun to the range, set up like I would when I shoot off the bench and move the entire scope in and out until I get the eye relief such that I get a full sight picture without straining my neck and eyes...yes sir I think with your help and prodding I may yet be able to use a scope properly..

After this one there will be only three more to go...

P.S. ..I feel a little embarrassed.... here I am at 69 with all that shooting experience behind me and don't know squat about scopes..thanks for your patience...Dan

 

[Brother_Love]

Good shooting and I love the rifle!!!! I am still looking for one.

 

[quicksylver]

Thanks BL....they are getting mire difficult to come by for a reasonable price...

 

[Ian]

diopters aren't meant to set eye relief..right?

That's what I've been trying to explain.

When you mentioned screwing the bell almost all the way out to get the amount of eye relief you needed, plus your aversion to scopes and chronic eye fatigue using them, black flags started waving. A scope that is properly adjusted and mounted for your eye shouldn't give you strain unless it's a $40 Chinese 4-20x50mm wannabe sniper scope filled with recycled coke bottle glass.

Like I mentioned in the other thread, you might want to just pull your scopes of and leave them on the kitchen table for a few days, taking many very short sessions peeking through them at a pre-determined blank space throughout the day and making adjustments. For me, after a minute or two of fiddling I have to quit for a while because my eyes get tired and can't tell if adjustments are better or worse. Getting the reticle to focus perfectly is tricky, since your eye will adjust in fractions of a second for imperfections of reticle focus......which is what causes the eye strain in the first place. You do not want your eye to have to be making that correction, it conflicts with the target focus and flexing back and forth between the target and reticle focus planes (if they aren't adjusted correctly for your unique eyeball) makes the muscles that bow your lens very tired in short order, whether you notice it immediately or not.

 

[35 shooter]

Good shooting with the 291. You can chalk me up as another that gets eye fatigue on longer range sessions. The older i get, the more i catch myself using cooling the bbl. as an excuse to rest my eyes after so many shots.

Hope my next eye check up helps a bit. Binoculars do me the same way, seemingly no matter how well adjusted.
Wish i could shoot irons again as well as you do, though i'm still pretty good with peeps till the target blurs into 2 different ones. Lol, when that happens, i've learned to shoot the one on the right...seriously.

 

[quicksylver]

35 it does get to be fun sometimes..I remember one long session with my 03a4 clone..I had just set it up and was sighting it in ...after about the 18th round I was seeing three orange dots moving around..so I just pretended it was a steel shoot with moving targets and fired at the darkest one....

My iron sight shooting is only regulated to the light conditions...stopping to let the barrel cool or gabbing with someone can cause me to loose the light...

BUT HEY ..we're still shooting...