Why didn't I have the foresight to.......

[hporter]

I was browsing some older files on my computer this morning and ran across an order form that I had submitted to NEF/H&R in the year 2011.

I had sent my .357 magnum Handi-Rifle back to the factory and had it fitted with 4 rifle barrels and 2 shotgun barrels and had the "factory trigger job" done to it.

I picked:

45-70 barrel with iron sights,
223 Bull Barrel with scope rail,
7.62x39 with scope rail,
44 Magnum with iron sights,
28 gauge shotgun,
20 gauge shotgun,

Then I ran across a pdf file that I saved from an older version of the barrel accessory ordering sheet:



I originally decided to place my order by using the logic that I could have a number of rifle barrels in multiple calibers for the same price as buying just a single new rifle.

For years, I have read threads on this site and others talk about the fun of developing cast loads for the 22 Hornet and 30-30 WCF. I have always enjoyed shooting single shot rifles, and thought that it would be fun to experiment with those two calibers in my Handi-Rifle.

So I have kept an eye out for "reasonably" priced H&R barrels. I browsed around on Gun Broker not too long ago and was amazed at the prices folks are getting for used Handi-Rifles and their barrels these days.

I sit here drinking my coffee looking at that price sheet, and want to kick myself for not having the foresight to throw in a 22 Hornet and a 30-30 barrel with my original order. The barrels that I ordered were slightly more expensive than the prices shown, but not by much. Hindsight is of course 20/20, but what a fantastic bargain those rifles and the accessory barrel program were in their day.

 

[richhodg66]

I'd kind of like a 7.62x39 barrel on a Handi. Probably won't really do anything a .30-30 won't do, but it's a neat little cartridge.

A few years ago, the wife got me a CVA Optima Elite she had seen me look at on a used rack. Much better rifles than the H&Rs ever were. Probably not a big enough market for it, but I wish they had a bigger caliber selection and a barrel addition program like that.

 

[CWLONGSHOT]

I have had about all H&R calibers thru the years accept a few of the rarest like 7x64 or 7.62x39. But multiples of the more common ones.

2x 30/30's was pretty good with jacketed but aweful W/cast.
3x 22 Hornets was AWEFUL with cast and passable W/jacketed then I bought a 1:9 Hornet and ding ding ding!! I re chambered to a K and still have. Its a wonderful shooter
The 35 Rem I had was immediately rechambered to 356/358 so no idea how it shot. But shot very well cast and jacketed for 356/358. (I modified the extractor to work with both.)

The 38/55 & 45/70 LONG GUNS both shot cast exceptionally While a 20" 45/70 wouldnt shoot cast at all. But did shoot 405g Remington hand loads well enough for 5-6 different folks to fill there freezers! (It was the "camp gun" used for rain days or when a gun broke.)

I kinda miss them but have resisted the Henrys and CVA's.

CW

 

[Jeff H]

I have to agree on all three - the Hornet, 30/30 and 7.62x39. They are very lovable little cartridges, among many other less popular ones.

I started privately pining for a Handi-Rifle back when the Shikari 45-70 was new, but was young and deferred to the wisdom of my "elders," most of whom were smart old guys and made a lot of sense. The 30/30, 30-40, Hornet, the "puny Russian cartridge" (as well as the old 6.5s) were passe' and "behind the times," "much more practical rounds to be had."

Took me many years (too many) to shuck the ingrained "wisdom" of so many others and, well, get my head out of my butt and pursue what I wanted to pursue. Having started too late, I managed to catch the tail end of, or was just be too late altogether for all the neat things I thought were so cool. Ironically, SOME of the "better" rounds suggested were as old or older than ones I thought were so cool. My own dad sat me down and convinced me how much better and more modern the 7x57 was than the 30/30. It later dawned on me that the 7x57 was OLDER than the 30/30. I do love the 7x57 too, but this is offered as an example of rationalizations which related to things so unlikely to occur that it really made no sens at all.

Standard rationalizations included the need for a hundred implausible "what-ifs" which never surfaced:
"What if" you get a chance to hunt bear in Alaska?
"What if" you get a chance to hunt pronghorn in Wyoming?
"What if" you get a chance to hunt moose in Canada?
"What if" you get a chance to hunt mule deer in Montana?
"What if" the world as we know it ceases to exist and you have to defend yourself against roving bands of desperados who want your food, your ammo and and yer wimminz?

Even as I have so much disdain for that last point as a realistic possibility on which to base your entire personal battery, it was still a seed planted, germinated, and which took root in the back of my mind, and it was literally rationalized to me that an old military Mauser in 7x57 would do all the above, to include standing up to round after round sent the way of desperadoes without burning up the barrel.

I eventually settled on the stuff I really wanted, other opinions be damned, but I moved away from the Handis and to the Contender Carbines. Boy, was that an expensive and long education! At this point, I no longer desire to have "one of each" and have consolidated - picked between the many really, truly cool cartridges and guns. I went back and forth between the 30/30 and the 7.62x39 for a long time. The 30/30 eventually came out on top. I waffled on the Hornet or the 222 (I don't CARE if the 223 is faster and more common) and settled in with the 222.

Finally, my most prized, most used, most useful and most enjoyed rifle is a break-open, single-shot 357 Magnum, and I am fortunate that I no longer kick myself for missing all those others, but yeah, it took me a long time to get my head out of my butt and I was too late to put together everything I'd rather had. Had I done that, it would also have been a lot less expensive than the things I DID have, but water under the bridge and I am happy now.

I do wish for others, especially younger folks, that such an amazing opportunity were available still - the Handis and the barrel program, I mean.

 

[richhodg66]

Standard rationalizations included the need for a hundred implausible "what-ifs" which never surfaced:
"What if" you get a chance to hunt bear in Alaska?
"What if" you get a chance to hunt pronghorn in Wyoming?
"What if" you get a chance to hunt moose in Canada?
"What if" you get a chance to hunt mule deer in Montana?
"What if" the world as we know it ceases to exist and you have to defend yourself against roving bands of desperados who want your food, your ammo and and yer wimminz?

I used to think about such things a lot more. Hunting is pretty rapidly losing the appeal it once had, I sure do like to be in the woods (when the weather isn't beating me up) and a nice rifle is a joy to have, but I have become pretty slow to pull a trigger on anything. I got to thinking the other day, the season ended and I did not shoot a single squirrel this past year, and squirrel hunting is one of the best past times there is. I did enjoy watching them while bowhunting.

As to the "SHTF" scenario, it's a big reason I quit frequenting the other site, way too many crazies and guys just plain fantasizing about it. Personally, if the world ever gets that bad, I don't wanna live it in anyway and will shoot it out with what I have on hand until they get me and be done with it. Too many things for me to worry and stresss about now without fantasizing about living The Walking Dead scenario.

I read Ed Harris' article about the modern Rook rifle and love the concept. My Savage 219 in the Hornet with light cast loads is probably about as close as I'll come, but I really like that rifle. Never had a jacketed round since I've owned it and don't remember ever shooting it past 35 yards or so. Just something about a slim single shot in the woods.

 

[hporter]

2x 30/30's was pretty good with jacketed but aweful W/cast.
3x 22 Hornets was AWEFUL with cast and passable W/jacketed

Well that real world experience is likely to save me some money, as I wouldn't shoot anything but cast in them. Since you had success with the 1:9 barrel - is it safe to assume that the problem was just the twist rate? Or was it something else?

 

[hporter]

Finally, my most prized, most used, most useful and most enjoyed rifle is a break-open, single-shot 357 Magnum

That is what motivated me to buy the extra barrels. An afternoon shooting the H&R Handi-Rifle 357 with open sights left a grin on my face that couldn't be wiped off.

I agree in priciple with your thoughts on not "having to have one of each". That is probably good advice to ponder on from time to time. I am just bad at the execution of such ideas. Though I seem to be getting better.

Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

 

[CWLONGSHOT]

Well that real world experience is likely to save me some money, as I wouldn't shoot anything but cast in them. Since you had success with the 1:9 barrel - is it safe to assume that the problem was just the twist rate? Or was it something else?

Im not confident in saying it was twist. Or at very least not all twist. All twists should have been fine none really fast for caliber as thats where I have had twist issues with cast.

I blame the crappy barrels. Hard and soft spots bored out of center swells within the bore (fat & thin or loose and tight spots) Lets face it, we loved them but they are bottom a the barrel firearms.

CW

 

[hporter]

I read Ed Harris' article about the modern Rook rifle and love the concept.

I've admired his Rook rifles too. They are as graceful and elegant as they are practical.

Back when I bought the extra barrels I was spending a lot of time reading the H&R forum over on the Graybeards website. All of the stub projects they were doing in all manner of calibers gives food for thought on what one's own custom caliber might be.

I would vote for a 32 S&W Long, but then a Handi-Rifle is so clunky and crude compared to the Rook rifles that Ed Harris has built. If one was to undertake a project like that, the money would likely be better spent starting with an old 410 shotgun like I believe he did with his. I like my Handi Rifles - but a marvel of quality and engineering they are not.

 

[hporter]

Lets face it, we loved them but they are bottom a the barrel firearms.

They were certainly built to a price point. If they weren't, they wouldn't have been so affordable.

But there is a virtue in that as well. I am not afraid to take them out in the field and have them get banged up or scratched (though obviously I try to avoid that). They are sort of like my Ruger American rifles that I love. They are a working gun, and inexpensive enough that I don't have to baby or worry over them like I do with my Shiloh Sharps or Browning BPCR.

I appreciate your sharing of your experiences with your Handi's. I hate to admit that I don't own a 30-30. But I suppose now I should look to a Savage or Stevens bolt action 30-30 or perhaps a Savage 219 to fill that niche. It has always struck me as un-American not to have one!

 

[CWLONGSHOT]

I've admired his Rook rifles too. They are as graceful and elegant as they are practical.

Back when I bought the extra barrels I was spending a lot of time reading the H&R forum over on the Graybeards website. All of the stub projects they were doing in all manner of calibers gives food for thought on what one's own custom caliber might be.

I would vote for a 32 S&W Long, but then a Handi-Rifle is so clunky and crude compared to the Rook rifles that Ed Harris has built. If one was to undertake a project like that, the money would likely be better spent starting with an old 410 shotgun like I believe he did with his. I like my Handi Rifles - but a marvel of quality and engineering they are not.

I had a number of stub barrels made by two different guys in graybeard thru the years. I have a 32/20 built by Trotter that Will go to my grave with. He also built me a 25/35 barrel. More than a few others for a number of folks. Including A nice 25/20 that went to Bill himself.

I do very much miss a number if friends that have passed that where made on that site. I was a member since it spun off the Marlin site until Bill and his son sold it.

I have a few friends, good friends I speak with and have met a few times all because of Graybeards.

CW

 

[hporter]

You caught my attention with the 32-20 and the 25-20, as I already load them for my Marlin levergun and Savage bolt actions. And a 25-35 would be a neat one to have.

I would much rather have a black powder era cartridge than anything modern. Especially for slinging lead downrange.

I sure am envious of your 32-20. I recall the name Trotter from Graybeards, but I didn't have the honor to know him. After posting this morning, I jumped over there and it seems the H&R forum is still active. Quickdtoo is even still the moderator of the H&R forum.

 

[Ian]

I should have sent mine in too, but at the time the program was nearing an end, money was tight. I have two Savage 219s in .30-30/16-gauge and they're pretty decent shooters. Nothing holds a candle to the old Winchester model 37 though, but I'm not going to modify it. It's 16-gauge big brother might get a 18.5" barrel turned down and O-ringed as an insert for a .30 Badger if I ever get a "round tuit".

 

[CWLONGSHOT]

You caught my attention with the 32-20 and the 25-20, as I already load them for my Marlin levergun and Savage bolt actions. And a 25-35 would be a neat one to have.

I would much rather have a black powder era cartridge than anything modern. Especially for slinging lead downrange.

I sure am envious of your 32-20. I recall the name Trotter from Graybeards, but I didn't have the honor to know him. After posting this morning, I jumped over there and it seems the H&R forum is still active. Quickdtoo is even still the moderator of the H&R forum.

Yup Timmy is still there and so is Bill from time to time. Along with a few others that are still around.

Ooh and there is two boards reloaded and graybeards. Bill left the one he sold and started up a new one!!

The 32/20 uses a SMLE barrel and is 24". It shoots very fine with a 140 MP bullet and IMR4227.

The 25/35 mostly eats Hornady 117 RN.

CW

 

[Bret4207]

I've admired his Rook rifles too. They are as graceful and elegant as they are practical.

Back when I bought the extra barrels I was spending a lot of time reading the H&R forum over on the Graybeards website. All of the stub projects they were doing in all manner of calibers gives food for thought on what one's own custom caliber might be.

I would vote for a 32 S&W Long, but then a Handi-Rifle is so clunky and crude compared to the Rook rifles that Ed Harris has built. If one was to undertake a project like that, the money would likely be better spent starting with an old 410 shotgun like I believe he did with his. I like my Handi Rifles - but a marvel of quality and engineering they are not.

Find an old Remington #4 or a Steven 44, not the high dollar 44 1/2. Either will make a fine little rifle, though the Stevens will be twice the weight, which can be a good thing.

 

[Bret4207]

IIRC correctly Marlin bought H+R? I think that was the death knell. Sad. Seems like someone would see the practicality of an inexpensive SS and produce some. Or, maybe those days are just done.

I never warmed up to the Handi's I handled in the shops. Like every Henry I've picked up, they all seemed terribly heavy for what they were. Maybe I'm a snob? I dunno. Loved the idea, just not the execution.

 

[CWLONGSHOT]

Yup Marlin bought H&R and there penny pinchers desolved them before Remington bought Marlin...

Cryin shame. No they wasnt great but generations grew up with them as a first gun.

CW

 

[Ian]

Weight can be a good thing....

Anything larger than .45 Colt that I've shot kicked the snot out of me. The stock comb shape is awful. the plastic stocks were better in that regard, but made the H*R's front heavy.

 

[Jeff H]

You caught my attention with the 32-20 and the 25-20, as I already load them for my Marlin levergun and Savage bolt actions. And a 25-35 would be a neat one to have.

I would much rather have a black powder era cartridge than anything modern. Especially for slinging lead downrange.

I sure am envious of your 32-20. I recall the name Trotter from Graybeards, but I didn't have the honor to know him. After posting this morning, I jumped over there and it seems the H&R forum is still active. Quickdtoo is even still the moderator of the H&R forum.

Larry, I think was his name. "Troggerlg" his handle on the forum.

Super guy. He took a botched rebore/rechamber job I had someone else do and depened the rim cut for me, as it woiudl on't close on a small handful of my cases. He actually did that for FREE, insisting that I send it to him so he could fix it. Heck of a guy.

 

[CZ93X62]

In 1975 when I became interested in handgunning, who on earth would have ever thought that a mainstream maker like Colt would be reduced to its 2000-era condition? If we have learned anything as arms hobbyists, it is that NOTHING is permanent in this field. If there is something you truly want, DO NOT DELAY.

I never thought that I would be able to own a Colt Python at a reasonable price. I can't express how happy I am to see The Snakes return, 6" Python and Anaconda will happen this year if enough of them hit the market.