Ben's Liquid Lube

[Ian]

Ben wrote: "A lot of substitutes people have suggested so far are water base. I figure that would be a great waste of time and $ to try and mix a water based material with Alox. Ben"

It can be done, but the water has to be cooked off first. Done it with Nu-finish car polish to get the polymer base. Throw a chip of Ivory soap in there with the Alox and that reduced base, warm it up good, add some mineral spirits, and it makes a creamy yellow-colored emulsion that will actually dry after a fashion. I'm not saying do it, but it's doable. I never liked the way it worked, seemed to cause leading. I'd definitely try to stick with natural or petroleum waxes for the BLL formula.

 

[Pistolero]

Ben,

First, let me say that I have always despised 'Mule Snot" (AKA Lee Liquid Alox) for the nasty smell,
and then the sticky, dirt grabbing residue on the bullet noses, and finally because the first three
times I tried it I had rotten results. Other than that, it has been great. ;-)

BUT - I have been working on getting up a good full wadcutter load for my .38s and .357s and today
I had the wife pick up a can of the Johnson's One Step and I have some of the LLA. Just ordered
a Lee 148 TL WC 6 holer from MidSouth, too. I have an H&G 50 and a couple of other WC molds,
including a low weight one from Lyman, I forget the number, but about 100-110 gr, IIRC. Also, I
have a couple of thousand Remington HBWCs that will be also used in the mix to see what works
the best. I guess I need to pick up a few more cans of this stuff before it is gone forever.

Any idea that mixing some solvent with Johnson's Paste Wax might match this stuff? Aren't
we back to 45/45/10 at that point? Not complaining, but maybe we are just wandering back
to the starting point. Never used 45/45/10 so cannot comment on how much like BLL it is
in application or function.

As far as using BLL as an antirust coating --- I think one of the main uses of Alox was as an automotive
antirust spray - I think it was what Zeibart sprayed into the rocker panels and under the cars back
in the bad old days when cars dissolved like Fizzies in the winter salt. (I trust that this group will
remember what Fizzies were !).

WAY off topic - but the KS governor just signed our Constitutional Carry law! I worked for
over a decade getting the original law, and now only 8 years later we have improved
things this much -- WOW!

Bill

 

[Ben]

Bill,

I've read the above, don't take this wrong, but I'm not certain what your question or point is ? ?

Ben

 

[Brad]

Is it similar to 45/45/10? Yes. But it is not the same. Far easier to make as there is no need to cook off solvents.
It also looks like the solvents used in the liquid wax evaporate far master than mineral spirits, this drastically speeds drying time.
This wax also seems to have an easier time giving a very thin coating and probably has better film strength.
Looking at the MSDS the paste was is an actual mix of waxes, the liquid wax also has some polymer waxes and other stuff. That stuff makes for a stronger coating.

 

[smokeywolf]

Just checked with a Home Depot in my area. They have at least a half dozen cans of Johnson's One Step. I'll be on my way in a couple of hours.
Anxious to try this.

 

[Pistolero]

Sorry, Ben - just you have convinced me to try your version of a tumble lube, and that is a
good thing. Never had any success with tumble type lubes, but the combination of nearly
zero bullet outside the case and your success has convinced me to try your version.

I was just wondering out loud about the One Step issue with future availability, thinking perhaps
we can recover by making some homebrew version of One Step from Johnson's Paste Wax and
some sort of a solvent. Then it dawned on my that the 45/45/10 was Alox and JPW and a solvent. . .
but Brad's clarification above make it clear that the comparison (I did note that I had never
used it) was pretty much off base and the waxes and solvents used in the One Step
are both different and better than 45/45/10. Still learning, guys.

No slam against your lube at all, just musing on a possible route to a longer term use of it.
Sounds like the JPW is not even close to equivalent to One Step. I only recently heard of this
"polymer wax" stuff because we just put down commercial "school tile" in our basement
and the instructions say to put down "a good polymer wax" before using it much. We
were not familiar with the stuff and had to go searching for products with a polymer
wax. I'll ask my wife what she wound up using.

I will be testing BLL soon and if I like it, I will purchase a number of bottles of One Step before
it is no longer available, so any "alternative" requirement seems to be well in the future.

Is a "conversation" the closest thing to a "PM" that we have here for direct communication
with members?

 

[Rick]

PM and Conversation are the same thing. Different brand software & using different names for the same thing.

 

[Ben]

Pistolero :

Try BLL, I think you'll like it.

Ben

 

[Pistolero]

I am getting ready to try it. I have been working on getting a standard
target .38 WC load that is accurate, so far nothing much has just jumped
out and shot super groups, but it has not been any sort of organized so far,
just some random trials.

 

[Ben]

Over on another forum..............
There are 512 post concerning the making of and use of Ben's Liquid Lube.
Many are trying to put WAY TOO MUCH of the liquid lube on their cast bullets.
I offered these tips , it might be helpful to some of you here ?
_________________________

Based on what I'm reading in many of the previous post , it seems that many of you are putting way too much BLL in your container with your cast bullets. If you want to waste your lube and slow down your drying time, you can continue doing it that way.

However, these tips may help you to use the lube more efficiently and speed up the drying time........

After you've rolled your bullets in BLL, if there is very much Ben's Liquid Lube left in the bottom of your container, you probably used too much. When the right amount is put into the container that you are rolling your cast bullets around in , there will be very little lube left in the bottom of the container and 98% of the lube will bond itself to your cast bullets while they are rolling around in the lube.

When your bullets are set out to dry on wax paper, if lube runs down the sides of the bullets and makes a ring around the base of the bullets on the wax paper , you definitely used too much .

If your bullets look like they don't even have any Ben's Liquid Lube on them when they are dry, you probably used just the right amount. A very small amount is needed on your cast bullets.



This is one situation where MORE isn't BETTER.

 

[Brad]

My take is that unless you notice a slight color change you used too much. It is a film lube, it isn't supposed to fill lube grooves.

 

[Ben]

Brad,

EXACTLY ! !, you get an " A " today, come to the head of the class.

Well spoken.

Ben

 

[Pistolero]

Ben,

Is Liquid Xlox the same stuff as Lee Liquid Alox called for in your recipe.

 

[Ben]

Yes, it is the same thing.

You can buy it from Lar's ( White label lubes ) MUCH cheaper.

 

[Ben]

" This is my TLC310-180-RF bullet and you simply cannot fill the bands any better with any other type of method. What I like about Ben's TL formula is how there is a hard coat film over the bullet, they are not sticky like they would be with the straight Alox. "

The comments above are from Michael at Ranch Dog Outdoors.
http://www.ranchdogoutdoors.com/
He seems to really like BLL ! !

 

[Brad]

Wow, he has been dip lubing with straight LLA for years, quite an endorsement if Michael changed .

 

[Ben]

quite an endorsement if Michael changed .

Yes, I think so.

I knew there was a lot of potential in the lube ( not bragging, but I did feel once people used it, they would have good things to say about it ) .

I find it interesting that my original instructions for making BLL called for 60 % Lee Liquid Alox ( or a suitable knock off brand of Alox like Lar's , etc ) mixed with 40% Johnson's One Step.

Michael, at Ranch Dog Outdoors, says he tried many different mixture ratios of the two products trying to improve on the mixture for his own use, only to come back to the 60 - 40 ratio as the optimum and best mixture for the 2 lube components.

Ben

 

[Ian]

That's outstanding, an endorsement from him means a lot, I think he probably has more experience shooting LLA-based lube coatings than just about anyone.

 

[Ben]

Yes, I'm certainly not in it for the $.

None the less, I'm glad to see Michael endorse BLL.
Like you say, his comments carry a lot of weight in the liquid / dip lube arena.

Ben

 

[358156hp]

We cast bullets to save money, not make it.

The line about saving money cracks me up every time I use it!