picked one of these up today

[fiver]

I couldn't help myself it was on close-out for $299.00.
this is the new version of the win. 1300 same bolt and some re-designed looks.
the trigger is a little rough and about 4-5lbs but the action is nice and smooth.
I like the recoil pad too, I can feel the difference between this one and my older 1300.
the barrel rib is narrower and the front bead is a bit bigger.
but all in all it reflects it's heritage quite nicely.
now once I figure out it's poa/poi interface I think this gun is gonna see lots of super effective trigger time.

Winchester may have gone through some changes a while back but I think they have their act together now day's and are always on my list of good guns to look at if I need something new.
the retail MSRP is even lower than a Mossberg.
http://www.winchesterguns.com/products/shotguns/sxp/sxp-field.html

 

[9.3X62AL]

I have an old Win 1200 I got for Christmas 1967. I have no idea how many thousands of shells I have run through it over the last 49 years, but it still goes hunting every dove opener with me. The 1200/1300 lineage is pretty obvious with these SXPs.

 

[fiver]

I haven't tore it down yet but it has the rotating bolt and many of the internals I could see looked correct.
I might try pulling the trigger group and see if they swap out.
I don't know if the barrels will or not.
the SIL just got a nice classic blued and wood 1300 the other day for 279.00 which I thought was a pretty good price considering it looked and felt like it spent more time in the closet than in the field.
[that little tension band on the back side of the receiver has very little bluing wear]
my first one is on it's second replacement butt stock and has the win-choke firmly entrenched in place.
I have always been able to shoot Winchester shotguns well right out of the box, but this one shoots a titch higher than my others.
i'll give it a little workout at the trap club tomorrow err later today and see how it does.

 

[waco]

Last shotgun I bought was a Stoger auto. A poor mans Benelli. It has the same inertia driven system as the Benelli.
This is my first auto and I rally like it. Fairly light and because it's not gas operated you can run hundred of rounds between cleaning without jams.

 

[Ian]

I'm a HUGE fan of the 1300. All the Winchester snobs shunned it because it was the next evolution of cheaper/faster production design and had a lot of plastic parts. I was told not to shoot mine too much or it would wear out/break. I was told the same thing about the Mossberg 500 (another favorite of mine) but I've shot the bejeezus out of three of them for years and they just keep getting smoother, faster, and better). The 1300 was smooth and fast right out of the box, and has done nothing but go to work for me with zero drama every time I pulled it out.

Any decent pump shotgun with screw-in chokes for $300 is a good deal in my book.

ETA, I started collecting the "best pump shotgun in the world" many years ago before I had much real experience with them. In that process I acquired two Model 12s in 12-gauge, one in 20, and a Model 42 in .410. Did a bird hunt and one sporting clays shoot with one of the 12s and the 42 (.410 was called for in the subgauge part of the shoot). After that my conclusion was I'm glad I was born in 1975 and have more choices. While a step above the 1899, the Model 12 isn't the best pump shotgun in the world after all.

 

[RicinYakima]

"Model 12 isn't the best pump shotgun in the world after all."
Of course, everyone knows the Ithaca Model 37 is the best pump shotgun ever made.

 

[9.3X62AL]

Watch that heresy, Ian. You know how the Model 12 collectors get. The Win 12/Rem 870/Ithaca 37 argument is about as fervent as the Ford/GM/Mopar dust-ups, and just as unsolvable. I have had all 3, and all have done exemplary work for me with minimal maintenance and upkeep. The Mossbacks aren't a bad gun either, I just bought my first of those about 8 months ago in 410 x 3".

 

[fiver]

I remember when those old model 12 trap guns were sitting everywhere I looked for about 200 bucks.
then they were all but gone and the prices doubled in about 3 weeks then they just disappeared off the tables and gun racks overnight.
only to reappear one here and one there at about 10 times their old day's price and treated like they were only made for 1 year from platinum and strontium coated titanium.
I have been through a number of shotguns in my time [oh my god have I gone through some shotguns]
the 12,120's 3-4 of them, a couple of 1300's ,a model 14, a model 14 super-X, 2-super-X2's in 3" and 2 others in 3-1/2", 2 model 50's, a couple of 101's, one in particular was a combination double and single barrel 101 set with spare frame and butt stock package [one for field use and one for trap use] god I miss that gun, and nice a set of 12-20-16ga model 12's,
a few Franchi's one in 20ga and a super nice model 48 [plus a trap gun combo I could swap to shoot left or right handed] a perazzi at one time, a techni-mec [they make parts for perazzi and whole guns from time to time] a couple of brownings, pump and their semi-auto gold, had a 3-1/2" 12 ga browning that wasn't a bad gun, a BT-99 [no 2 of those] I flat wore both of them out, and a BT-100, a mossburg 835 unti-mag, a stevens or two, marlin goose gun, a Belgian made A-5 for a while, a couple of 870's, 3-4 1187's a model 1100 trap and a model 1100 field, 3 different Ruger red labels have passed through my hands, a few 10gauges have come and gone, a handful of 410 and 28 gauge guns as well, a Remington 3200 I still have, a super-x2 in 3" and 3-1/2", a Winchester 1200 in 20ga, 2- 1300's, a NEF pump, and a Remington model 48 I shoot grouse with occasionally.

that's about all of them I can remember right now but I know there has been more [some side X sides] and duplicates of several already listed.
a couple of them lasted less than a week [a Franchi semi-auto I mailed back to the factory in a medium flat rate box] 2 of the 870's were dead in under 2 weeks, the first 11-87 had parts coming out of it's insides within a month.
one of the 3-1/2" super X-2's made it almost three years then flat was done [it needed an arsenal rebuild] and a Browning A-5g made it 2 before giving up the ghost.
I didn't have the heart to run the model 50 down like that so i swapped it off, then i bought it back a couple of months later because I missed it so much [man I shot a lot of skeet with that old girl]

 

[KHornet]

Always favored Ithaca 37s, have two of them. However I prefer
side by side doubles.

 

[Ben]

Fiver,

That is a fine looking shotgun !

Ben

 

[Ian]

I still like my 101 for clay birds and a Mossberg pump for real ones. Tang safety wins for this lefty.

 

[RBHarter]

I preface this with I am not a gun snob......... I just like what I like .

I have a 97' , BPS , M37 , A5 , Boito O/U , Stevens 720,1909P and that ugly 1 with the beer can on the muzzle sold by Sears and Monkey Wards , a real 1200 , a reshaped 1200 sold by Sears, and several model 12s.

Among others that have come and gone are M500 , 1300, 1100, assorted singles and at least 2 wonder lust let downs .
Of those that are gone I miss only the Falcon 410 single and the Ithaca single with the lever gun like action release .

The A5 is a long lusted after gun , it's a Belgian with a white reciever in the Magnum persuasion, it is not a let down . The Boito O/U is a simple working gun that I can't feel bad about dropping in the mud . It just works an keeps working.

If forced to pick a best shot gun of those that I've actually used over the last 40 years , no contest , it's the BPS . It's as smooth and solid as the M12 , bottom feed eject like the 37 , steel reciever, the bolt locks in the bbl extention , interchangeable bbls , screw in chokes , fluid lines , top safety , glass trigger and generally scaled to gauge .

 

[Ian]

My FIL had a Belgian A5, IIRC it had a factory-engraved receiver. We sold it out of the estate before I got to shoot it, but it went to a good home so all's well.

I plan to take a closer look at the BPS, looks like from features alone I might have to agree with you.

 

[fiver]

you'd like the bps.
I remembered a few more shotguns I've had over the years after thinking about it a bit more.
I forgot about the colt and the weatherby and the browning pump trap gun.

I have always wanted the Armalite 12ga but have never even seen one.

 

[9.3X62AL]

The BPS x 410 was my intended target late last year, and only the appearance of the little Mossback at the local pawnshop for very low dollars intercepted its purchase. That BPS seems to combine all of the best pump action features into an ambidextrous design that just flat WORKS.

 

[freebullet]

Congrats on the shotgun fiver!

I prefer the tang safety or an exposed hammer. Never find those accidentally off as I've observed with trigger guard safties after walking thick stuff.

 

[Pistolero]

If you look at the guts of a lot of the pump guns, it appears that the Ithaca 37 is the base design of about
6 or 7 others, HiStandard, Mossberg 500 and more. All are very similar designs that are really simple and
work well. Biggest change was aluminum receivers with a barrel extension for the bolt to lock into rather than
a steel receiver and bolt locked to receiver.

Not familiar with the Win 1300, though.

Bill

 

[RBHarter]

The 1300 uses the rotary bolt type lock .

 

[fiver]

yep the pump and the semi-auto Winchesters use a rotary locking bolt that locks in the back of the barrel.
think AR-15 only in shotgun form.
personally I think that Stoner pretty much ripped off the Winchester shotgun system and modified the gas operations to suit a rifle.
you can tear down a model 12 or 13 or 14 bolt and an AR bolt side by side and except for one spring [and the gas tube] they look just like an engineered version of the other.

 

[Pistolero]

Upon reflection, I have to clarify my comments above. It was the High Standard Flite King and the Ithaca
Model 37 have very similar lockup designs - a lower slide assy which cams the rear
of the bolt up into a notch in the receiver to lock the bolt. The Mossberg design used a lower
slide which cams up a locking lug in the bolt, rather than the whole rear of the bolt, and the
locking lug locks into an extention of the barrel rather than the receiver.

But the basic design is really similar on all these. Sheet metal U-shaped shell lifter, stamped side shell disconnector
for releasing shells from the mag, and a lower slide assy lifting up either the rear of a tilting
breech block or a tilting locking lug inside a non-tilting breech block, all have all the trigger/hammer/disconnector
guts on a removeable trigger guard assy - although these became steadily simpler and more easily removed with each
successive redesign - by different companies, usually.

If you compare it to the 1897 Win or the Model 12 Win and you find essentially no parts which look or
function very much like the ones in these mechanical cousins. Anyone who has ever disassembled a Win 97
has to have marveled at the incredible complexity of the swiss cheesed block of steel, machined in odd,
complex shapes on all surfaces, with seemingly dozens of internal passages that is the Win 97 bolt. It must have
cost a fortune to make. Some of the cuts seem to defy imagination on how they were done.

The rotaty bolt idea seems to be strong, but shotgun pressures are so low that it seems
unnecessary - although it may be smoother and more durable in the long run compared to
the tilting block design.

Bill