Powder Storage question

[Brad]

Below ground in a 100% waterproof container is the only way to fly. Mine's all at the bottom of a lake, but it's safe and only I know where it is

They don’t have lakes in the desert you call South central Texas

 

[Ian]

Sure we do! You might call it a mud puddle behind a 3' tall dam across the riverbed, but we calls it a lake!

 

[Missionary]

Funny how word usage is a variable. In SW Michigan a lake was big enough to water ski on it. And not in little circles.

 

[RBHarter]

I looked up a number of usgs definitions.
Stream , you may step across dry .
Creek , you will get one foot wet crossing.
River , you will get both feet wet .
Navigable water way , a conveyance may carry any dry cargo or passenger exclusively by floatation .
The division between lake and pond is the photopic (SP) ( not sure that's the right word) layer where no light reaches any or a portion of the bottom .

Lake Tahoe until 1982 or so was more often a pond than a lake ........

 

[Petrol & Powder]

In Virginia the things they call "rivers" would be classified as a "creek" any place else.
I'm not sure who we are fooling other than ourselves.

 

[Winelover]

^^^lot of that going on in Arkansas. Cindy hikes on Wednesdays with a group of women hikers. They have to plan their hikes based on precipitation totals, for hikes that include water features. Otherwise, they are left high & dry.

 

[JonB]

Sure we do! You might call it a mud puddle behind a 3' tall dam across the riverbed, but we calls it a lake!

That's a reservoir, LOL.
Although, in MN (Land of 10,000 lakes) we call everything a lake, could be a Marsh, a Reservoir, a Slough, a Swamp, a Bog with water around it, even a Backwater in a river...we call 'em all Lakes !

 

[smokeywolf]

Reminds me of my quarter horse mare. If we came to a stream or creek that was 5 or 6 feet across she'd jump it instead of getting her hooves wet. Funny part was, if it was a small irrigation ditch 14 inches across, she wouldn't just step over it, she'd jump it. If it was a creek or stream 20 to 30 feet across, she'd still try to jump it and we would land in a colossal splash 8 or 10 feet out from the bank.

 

[Petrol & Powder]

At least she was consistent

 

[JWinAZ]

For smokeless powder in quantities between 20 and 50 pounds, and black powder up to 20 pounds, NFPA 495 specifies a wooden box or cabinet having walls at least 25.4mm (1 inch) nominal thickness. I do not find a definition of nominal in the NFPA definition section.

Softwood lumber of 1" nominal thickness is 3/4" actual thickness. I understand how and why the term nominal is used, and for a great variety of items. My take is that if a box of 3/4" actual thickness is used, compliance with the NFPA is achieved. I do understand that the NFPA is not law and is a best practice. However, it does seem that this could be a point of mis-understanding for someone not familiar with what nominal means.

Personally, I made my box out of 2" nominal lumber. I'm a recovering engineer and this lack of specificity just bugs me.

We have dry washes here in Arizona. Some won't run water for years.

 

[Petrol & Powder]

JWinAZ, I come from an entire family of engineers, so I feel your pain. And I too know the definition of Nominal and I’m sure you do as well, but I thought I would include it here for clarity for all.

From the Cambridge Dictionary:

Nominal - in name or thought but not in fact or not as things really are.

In the context of the NFPA suggestion (and suggestion is exactly what that is) a 1" thick wooden wall or something close to 1" is what they are talking about.

It is difficult for some people to understand the lack of authority in: standards, best practices, policy, guidelines, professional norms, etc. NONE of those things are laws. Sometimes laws incorporate some standards or even adopt some standards but until there is a law – it’s pretty much just a suggestion.

There’s nothing wrong with looking to the NFPA for some guidance, but that’s all that is…..guidance. There’s no reason to get wrapped around the axle over non-commercial powder storage. We do our best to not create a large bomb in the event of a structure fire but beyond that, it’s academic.

I think most folks on this forum and firearm owners in general, want to store powder and primers in such a matter that the items do not endanger firefighters.

 

[JWinAZ]

@Petrol & Powder You are absolutely right, and put it into perspective very nicely, thank you.

 

[fiver]

here if it's a lake it's a natural lake.... [usually a filled up volcano]
everything with a dam is a reservoir.

 

[RBHarter]

Where code , ordinance, or local law exists it is generally drawn verbatim from the NFPA .

 

[Ian]

I'm a recovering engineer

It's been 23 years and I'm still recovering from that trauma. I hear sodium channel blockers help...

 

[fiver]

NFPA is a guideline, the Fire Marshal has the final word in his jurisdiction.

 

[imashooter2]

I have a 1950s chest freezer with the latch removed (no magnetic strip in 1950). In a fire, it will certainly keep the powder below flash point longer than a wood crate and I find it difficult to believe that the top won’t lift and vent well before a side blows out.

Now then… show of hands… who has less than 50 pounds of powder in stock?

 

[Winelover]

 

[Petrol & Powder]

NFPA is a guideline, the Fire Marshal has the final word in his jurisdiction.

And the authority of a fire marshal is limited by the law. The authority granted to a fire marshal differs by jurisdiction.
In my state, not every county appoints a fire marshal and if they do appoint a fire marshal that fire marshal can only enforce building codes IF the jurisdiction grants that authority to said fire marshal.
The fire marshal MAY have the final word or he may not - it depends on what authority is specifically granted to him.

 

[CWLONGSHOT]

The or A Fire Martial is the RECOGNIZED authority in and under most circumstances, surrounding and pertaining to this conversation.
May have been better wording... More vague and precise at same time...